Saccharomyces cerevisiae var. diastaticus

[SourBrewer]

So I read that WY3711 French Saison/Danstar Belle Saison were classified as a strain of Saccharomyces cerevisiae var. diastaticus. It is a superattenuating strain that gives off wicked flavors. While trying to find more info about it, I found this article about another strain of var. diastaticus found in Brazilian cassava flour factories:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC204282/

So I decided to see what I can isolate from this Brazilian cassava flour. I will update this thread with microscope and plate pics as I work on it. Hopefully, I will find a new Brazillian saison strain.

 

[FTowne1]

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[Der Fuchs]

Subscribed.

 

[SourBrewer]

12/16/14 8pm

~1.040 wort with a hefty dose of cassava flour going on top of the fridge at ~75F.

 

[SirDickButts]

awwwww yiss.

 

[doobiegoobie]

So cool

 

[timos1]

awesome

 

[abawol01]

Very curious to see if you are able to harvest anything. Also curious to see if the yeast has any awesome flavor/attenuation properties.

 

[SourBrewer]

Very curious to see if you are able to harvest anything. Also curious to see if the yeast has any awesome flavor/attenuation properties.

As long as they didn't do some kind of cleaning treatment on their product, I am sure I will harvest something. Whether it's var diastaticus, I will probably will not know.

So far, no fermentation. Same goes for the Beersel Vielle OG dregs in the jar next to it, started at the same time.

 

[barfdiggs1]

Whether it's var diastaticus, I will probably will not know.

The assays they use in that paper are pretty simple stuff, so if you actually want a quantitative measurement of excreted amylotic activity, let me know, and I can measure it for you in the lab to see if you are in the ball park for what they measured in the paper.

Actually classifying the taxonomy on the other hand, while not hard, requires a **** load of different reagents and tests that I don't have access to. Without sequencing the genome though, its still a bit of a hand wavy way of classification (awaiting angry microbiologists with torches coming my way).

 

[SourBrewer]

It started fermenting today. Smells pretty gross like when you toss some malt in wort for a spontaneous ferment.

 

[csano]

Stupid question, but did you just whip up some 1.040 wort using DME and some yeast nutrient and toss a handful of flour into the jar? Checking it daily by opening the jar and smelling it?

 

[SourBrewer]

Stupid question, but did you just whip up some 1.040 wort using DME and some yeast nutrient and toss a handful of flour into the jar? Checking it daily by opening the jar and smelling it?

Almost. No nutrient. I only opened to smell after it started fermenting.

 

[abawol01]

Almost. No nutrient. I only opened to smell after it started fermenting.

Gotta be the lack that's in that flour. I imagine you will probably have to separate the sacc from it somehow.

How?

I have no idea.

 

[SourBrewer]

Gotta be the lack that's in that flour. I imagine you will probably have to separate the sacc from it somehow.

How?

I have no idea.

I will plate in on some agar plates and pull about 10 yeast colonies for single strain fermentations. Based on colony shape and color will identify which are yeast. From there I can put them under the microscope to see what shapes the colonies, from there ican use a best guess for species. Finally fermentation trials. It will takes several weeks to months. I will post pics as I go.

 

[Beerontwowheels]

I will plate in on some agar plates and pull about 10 yeast colonies for single strain fermentations. Based on colony shape and color will identify which are yeast. From there I can put them under the microscope to see what shapes the colonies, from there ican use a best guess for species. Finally fermentation trials. It will takes several weeks to months. I will post pics as I go.

What's your background/education in?

I should have asked for a microscope, loop, bunson burner and other plating materials for xmas. And some experience so as not to waste said equipment.

Can't wait to see what you find.

 

[SourBrewer]

What's your background/education in?

I should have asked for a microscope, loop, bunson burner and other plating materials for xmas. And some experience so as not to waste said equipment.

Can't wait to see what you find.

I am a CNC programmer specializing in plastic injection mold bases.

I read books and bought a microscope. I started with looking a commercial yeast and dregs to figure out what known species of yeast and bacteria look like. I got tips from ths yeast rancher blogs like bootleg biology, science brewer, brett project and eureka brewing.

 

[sliverx]

Subscribed.

This

 

[Beerontwowheels]

I am a CNC programmer specializing in plastic injection mold bases.

I read books and bought a microscope. I started with looking a commercial yeast and dregs to figure out what known species of yeast and bacteria look like. I got tips from ths yeast rancher blogs like bootleg biology, science brewer, brett project and eureka brewing.

Awesome. Putting that **** on my amazon watch list then.

 

[SourBrewer]

Awesome. Putting that **** on my amazon watch list then.

I am using this.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0032VFC84/?tag=talkbecom09-20

It works good for the price. I get sterile disposable dishes, parafilm, peptone, yeast extract and other consumables from Ebay and Amazon. I get agar powder from the asian market. I find Thai Telephone brand works well. My crack scale and wire inoculating loop came from those places as well.

 

[Skittle34]

Yeast, the final frontier. Some seriously cool **** you're doing mang

 

[libbey]

Subscribed.

This

 

[blue_bleeder]

CNC programmer

 

[SourBrewer]

The culture smells like pure vomit now, definitely butyric.

Under the scope I see nothing resembling a Saccharomyces yet. I will give it some time to see if something pops up.

 

[SourBrewer]

I am working on a Oude Beersel Vielle culture simultaneously. If I am pouring agar plates, I might as well plate them both.

Here are some shots of whats going on in Beersel.

Probably a Saccharomyces:

Some kind of yeast, maybe Brett and a few bacteria in the background:

Another type of yeast:

 

[Ataraxia1]

Damn, these cells are small and dispersed compared to the CHO (Chinese Hamster Ovary) cells I look at for work.

Side note: SIPed collagen-based polystyrene microcarriers in PBS smell naaasty

 

[SourBrewer]

12 days later I see some different critters in the Brazilian cassava culture.

Possible Sacch cell.

Another. This is about as big as the largest commercial Sacch I have seen, Safale US-05.

Not sure what these are, never seen them before. Maybe cassava dust.

Another oddball, probably a bubble, but they don't normally look like this.

Another possible Sacch cell and a bubble (?), surrounded by bacteria.

A possible different type of yeast cell, more of an average size for a Sacch.

I will pour some plates and streak this tomorrow after work.

 

[SourBrewer]

The Beersel looks better. Full of fun shaped critters and less bacteria. I will plate this tomorrow as well.

 

[quirkzoo1]

pretty sure I recognize this one, hope you don't die.

But seriously, I love what you are doing here, very interested to see the results. I have cultured a wild sourdough starter off of Organic Rye Flour that has lacto, brett and tons of other stuff in it but I would love to take a look under a microscope and see that it looks like.

 

[ncaudle]

pretty sure I recognize this one, hope you don't die.

no worries, this is the California politically correct strain - now with less bleeding!

 

[SourBrewer]

For comparison, here is a shot of Safale US-05.

 

[SourBrewer]

Poured plates tonight. Streaked Beersel, Brazilian and a contaminated vial of BSI Drie.

Probably will be able to pull colonies in a week.

 

[SourBrewer]

9 days growth. Whatever that filthy bacteria is in the Brazil culture, it seems to be anaerobic or else these plates would be covered with it. The large dark spots are airborne mold that hit the plate while I was streaking. The medium and small colonies are most likely yeast. I will check them under the scope when selecting colonies.

 

[Skittle34]

Sweet Jesus

 

[SourBrewer]

I picked through the colonies for a few hours. I def found a colony of yeast on one of the Beersel plates. On the old Drie and Cassava cultures I found a couple bugs of interest, but not exactly what I was looking for. From 10 plates I pulled 14 colonies. We'll see how they ferment as isolates now.

 

[SourBrewer]

Drie 1

Beersel 3

Beersel 2

Brazil 1

Brazil 2

Brazil 3

 

[drgarage1]

Drie 1

Beersel 3

Beersel 2

Brazil 1

Brazil 2

Brazil 3

you're my hero

 

[juanmalamunga]

 

[SourBrewer]

Last night I had a chance to see how the isolates were doing.

Drie 1- No ferment? Smells sticky and looks thick

Brazil 1- Smells like solvent

Brazil 2- Smells like canned corn/feet

Brazil 3- Smells like canned corn/feet

Beersel 1- Corn/feet, no pellicle

Beersel 2- Sweat/corn, no pellicle

Beersel 3- Corn/solvent, typical pellicle

Beersel 4- ***Winner, smells delicious, no pellicle

Beersel 5- Corn/solvent

Beersel 6- Sweat/Acetic(?), thin pellicle

Beersel 7- Rubbery thick pellicle, chem/foot smell

Beersel 8- Corn/chem smell, typical pellicle

Beersel 9- No ferment?



It seems I did not find anything good in cassava flour. I did end up with what seems like a good one from Oude Beersel. I will check it out under the scope tonight, test pH and gravity. It will get added to my collection and will be used in my next round of strain comparisons. I will dump the others except the 2 unfermented. I will hold those for a few more weeks.

 

[SourBrewer]

Beersel 4:

That's what it looks like, definitely yeast. pH is 4.3 so probably not contaminated with bacteria. Gravity is around 1.030, but it is only been going for 9 days. The jar looked still and the yeast was caked on the bottom. Can't say for sure if it can consume anything more than simple sugars.