Let's Talk About Mad Fritz

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Zach1

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New thread?

Yup. I thought I'd start a thread on Mad Fritz brewing, since not many people know of it, but Nile (the brewer) is making some wonderful stuff. This post is kind of an info dump -- sorry about that -- but I think it's needed since there's not too much information out there. Seriously, there's maybe ten posts on all of TalkBeer and that other site. I've put in spoilers maybe interesting and helpful but probably superfluous thoughts.

Cool, I'll go check it out, so where is the brewery?

The brewery itself is up in St. Helena (Napa). It's basically a medium-sized room in the same building as a couple other business offices. There is an additional room for storage, and malting barley, but the place is small by any standards. I'm kicking myself for not having taken a pic of the interior since I was just up there...

While Mad Fritz distributes some of their beers you'll need to visit the brewery to try their full selection or buy bottles. If you contact Nile about visiting the brewery, he will host a small tasting, and either himself or an assistant will be there to answer questions and talk about the beers. While not your typical taproom it's a lot of fun.

Huh, Napa's a bit of a drive, can you first tell me who this Nile guy is?

As mentioned, he's the head brewer of Mad Fritz. For a while he was also the only brewer. In the last few weeks, though, I believe he's hired an assistant brewer. Or that's what I've been told. Anyways, if you want to know more about his background and focus, there's a neat interview by GoodBeerHunting.

If you want the tl;dr version, though, I'll try help. No guarantees of accuracy, though, since this is from memory. Alright, Nile started home brewing when he was eighteen or so, but transitioned to wine making in college. Eventually he became a vintner for David Arthur Vineyards. I'm unsure, but I believe he was still home brewing while he professionally made wine. Around 2015, he decided he wanted to start making beer professionally too, and opened Mad Fritz.

Okay, consider me interested, but what styles does Nile brew?

It's best to describe what Nile doesn't brew, since if you look at his releases, he's bottled everything from Weizenbocks to imperial stouts with no real preference. He's told me he doesn't like sour beers, but he will occasionally make use of brett, and otherwise just about any style is fair game.

That said, Nile doesn't like to label his beers with a style, though he will to roughly convey what to expect. He says he doesn't brew to style, and he's not just saying that to seem different, there's legitimacy to his statement. Some of his beers can easily be identified as a certain style. But many are slight yet distinct divergences from classic styles. And sometimes what he makes really has no identifiable style (like his wier = wine + beer series).

Now, there are some general themes to his beer...

First is the lack of adjuncts. Not counting wheat, which Nile will list as an adjunct, only a small handful of his beers have any adjuncts at all. He let's the water, malt, hops, yeast, and barrel be the focus.

His beers also have an obvious focus on balance and depth. Yes, those are buzzwords, but what's popular in craft beer is exactly the opposite. Nile's made no attempts at pastry stouts or hazy IPAs, even though beer geeks go crazy for that stuff, so it's easy to infer his priorities.

Lastly, one of Nile's goals is creating what he calls "origin beers". These are beers made only from local ingredients. So, he's growing barley with the help of some nearby farmers, and has a malt house to malt his own barley. He uses water from local wells, and of course, barrel's from Napa wineries. Essentially, he wants to have control over the whole process of making the beer, from growing the ingredients to selecting the barrels to brewing the beer. And he also wants to impart a sense of place or "origin" to his beers. It's a long process, though, and this year marked the first origin beer he's released.

Alright, I enjoy more than hazy IPAs and pastry stouts, just tell me if Nile's beers are good.

In my opinion, yes, they are really damn good. After the spoiler are some recommendations.

I first tried Nile's beers during SF Beer Week last year and I was interested enough to visit Napa. I dropped by his brewery a few months later for a bit of a tasting. While I enjoyed the experience, and thought the beers were interesting and mostly good, I left a bit disappointed.

Looking back, I think there were a couple reasons for this. I arrived late so I didn't give the beers time to warm; I hadn't yet experienced beers with forward and complex malt profiles and was expecting something else; I believe Nile's beers benefit from time in the bottle; and I think Nile was still dialing in the beers (based on other people's observations).

Anyways, this September, I had the chance to join Nile's beer club. I actually wasn't planning to, but after listening to the GoodBeerHunting interview and reading all I could on his previously released beers, I decided I would join.

I still wasn't expecting great beers. I was expecting interesting beers, that would sometimes be very good and always skillful, but probably not my favorite cup of tea. Half the reason I joined is I like the brewing process and I thought Nile's brewing process was really neat.

Anyways, since joining, the first club allocation was released and I've visited the brewery twice. The robust porter and plum ale included in the allocation, plus several other beers I'll mention below, were all exceptional. Different people, different palates, but to mine some of these beers were among the best I've had. Here are some of my favorites that are still available...

The Peacock and the Crane - The recent batch was aged several months in fresh Chardonnay barrels. Nile says it's most like a Kellerbier but I haven't tried that style. Behind the barrel it reminds me of a lager with a softer, more medium mouthfeel. But there's also prominent Chardonnay notes from the barrel. Some light hoppiness is present too with a tiny amount of nuttiness from what I'm guessing is the malt. This is a good beer to get if you want something that's delicate but has dimension.

The Lion and the Mouse
- If you want a beer with great malt flavor this is the one I'd recommend. The spice, dried fruit, and sweetness from the malt, barrel, and light hopping integrate for a banana-bread taste. Like many of Nile's beers it has a soft, medium mouthfeel and a certain earthiness on the nose. My favorite of today's visit.

The Crow and the Water // The Ringdove and the Hunter // The Old Man and Death - Mad Fritz has three ales that really focus on roast flavors from the malt. For each, the roast is so damn good that the beer would be really enjoyable with nothing else. So, that's the baseline, but then Nile's weaved in vinous red wine, woodsy barrel, and some dark fruit, spice, caramel, and chocolate malt flavors too. The recent batch of "The Ringdove and the Hunter" is the best of these, presenting all these flavors most boldly, but also with the best balance. I don't think it's available though. But the other two options, which I know are still available, remain great alternatives. Comparing the two, the imperial stout "The Old man and Death" has more red wine character, less roast, but is not as fresh as the dry stout "The Crow and the Water".

Note: Bottles are almost always priced at $25. It's expensive, especially for styles like IPAs or lagers, so be aware of that. When I visited in early November, Nile talked a while about the costs of production, and it's just that. The ingredients he seeks out, and especially the small scale of production, are what's driving the price if you're curious.

Look, I'd like to try Mad Fritz, but I'm broke from buying loons on mybeercellar. Can you BIF?

Sorry, I'm broke too, but I do want to get Nile's beers in the hands of others. I'm planning to get some more bottles and I'll look to share with any one in the Bay (or SD while I'm down) who's interested. If I forget that I'm a student, and start feeling fiscally irresponsible, I might even LIF.

Can I threadshit?

Yes, but only with festive gifs, I'm feeling that holiday spirit.

 
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This is even more of a sales pitch for a specific brewery than is typical for TB, which is impressive in it's own right.

Also, asking for threadshitting with gifs in a regional forum? Get lost from ISO:FT?
 
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This is even more of a sales pitch for a specific brewery than is typical for TB, which is impressive in it's own right.

Yeah, kinda. The brewery is really out of the way for most people. I figured that's one reason people don't know of it, since they can just get good stuff much closer by, so making it seem like a good brewery was kind of the point. Well, that and just what the brewery is about, since there's not much out there.

Also, asking for threadshitting with gifs in a regional forum? Get lost from ISO:FT?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
I recently had 3 Mad Fritz beers sent to me by a friend. One was a pretty standard but good DuPont type saison. One was another Belgian type that just wasn’t that great, but mostly ok. The last was labeled as an IPA, but there was a sticker that said “with Brett!” And then the back of the label listed the barrel used. It was, without exception, the worst beer I’ve tasted in years. I don’t even remember the name of these beers because I’ve tried to put them out of memory. It was either forgettable or bad, and I’m pretty ok not trying to find this stuff again.
 
I recently had 3 Mad Fritz beers sent to me by a friend. One was a pretty standard but good DuPont type saison. One was another Belgian type that just wasn’t that great, but mostly ok. The last was labeled as an IPA, but there was a sticker that said “with Brett!” And then the back of the label listed the barrel used. It was, without exception, the worst beer I’ve tasted in years. I don’t even remember the name of these beers because I’ve tried to put them out of memory. It was either forgettable or bad, and I’m pretty ok not trying to find this stuff again.

Cool, at least some one else has had their beers, even if it wasn't a good experience.

There's definitely more misses with Mad Fritz beers than those by other breweries. I really don't like their DIPA. Some of their beers lean too heavily on black malt and goldings hops and are really unappealing to me. There's a good number that are fine, but as you said, unmemorable. I'm still really impressed, though, with their best offerings.
 
No
And based on this thread I would avoid.

Sure, that's up to you.

More seriously, though, what's so toxic about this thread?

My perspective is Mad Fritz is an interesting and good brewery that's relatively unknown and very out of the way. If you live in California, you've got all your basic beer needs covered, at least within driving distance. No one will go and try this brewery unless they think it's both good and making styles of beers that can't be found nearby. So, almost the whole of what I wrote was on those two points, plus some other asides.

I totally get that it reads like an advertisement. I could have just written "Has any one had Mad Fritz beers? What did you think?" and maybe got more responses. I thought about just doing that. But so few people have tried Mad Fritz beers, and less their full lineup, that I don't think the thread wouldn't have gone anywhere. So, I decided to write up in some detail why I think it's worthwhile visiting the brewery, and maybe more people visit the brewery and it goes from there.

Anyways, it's obvious I've made a mistake with this thread, but hopefully it's also clear that my intentions were well meant. It certainly wasn't my goal to write something to the detriment of the TB community. So, I'm genuinely interested in your response, since I'm still blind to what went so wrong. Thanks in advance.
 
Sure, that's up to you.

More seriously, though, what's so toxic about this thread?

My perspective is Mad Fritz is an interesting and good brewery that's relatively unknown and very out of the way. If you live in California, you've got all your basic beer needs covered, at least within driving distance. No one will go and try this brewery unless they think it's both good and making styles of beers that can't be found nearby. So, almost the whole of what I wrote was on those two points, plus some other asides.

I totally get that it reads like an advertisement. I could have just written "Has any one had Mad Fritz beers? What did you think?" and maybe got more responses. I thought about just doing that. But so few people have tried Mad Fritz beers, and less their full lineup, that I don't think the thread wouldn't have gone anywhere. So, I decided to write up in some detail why I think it's worthwhile visiting the brewery, and maybe more people visit the brewery and it goes from there.

Anyways, it's obvious I've made a mistake with this thread, but hopefully it's also clear that my intentions were well meant. It certainly wasn't my goal to write something to the detriment of the TB community. So, I'm genuinely interested in your response, since I'm still blind to what went so wrong. Thanks in advance.
It reads like you're in the club and really want to drive up the trade value for the bottles.

That may or may not be the case, but for someone that joined like a month ago and doesn't have a history on this site, it's hard not to be suspicious.

Also, why bother with a sales pitch for a brewery unless you're involved with the operation? What's the end goal for you in that situation?
 
It reads like you're in the club and really want to drive up the trade value for the bottles.

That may or may not be the case, but for someone that joined like a month ago and doesn't have a history on this site, it's hard not to be suspicious.

Also, why bother with a sales pitch for a brewery unless you're involved with the operation? What's the end goal for you in that situation?

Yeah, okay, I see what you mean. I don't think Mad Fritz bottles will ever have trade value. I don't think I can change that either. For that matter, Mad Fritz can ship thanks to Nile's wine license, so no one needs to trade for bottles. Even people who live on the East coast could get any Mad Fritz bottle for the cost of shipping.

The end goal was just to get some people to visit the brewery and try Mad Fritz beers. The tastings are free, by the way, so the only cost is the time you spend getting to Napa. Why do I care? I mean, we're on a site called "Talk Beer", I like talking about beer. Mad Fritz is different, I think what Nile's started is more interesting than the typical brewery, and I think it'd be fun to discuss what he's doing.
 
I went to the Ale Apothecary / Mad Fritz SFBW event last year (actually false, I went to the venue the day after) and tried a couple of the MF's while loading up on Ale Apothecary and MF seemed harmless enough, kinda rustic old school styles... until I saw the price tags on the MF stuff...

You know things are out of control when you're an Ale Apothecary enthusiast complaining about another brewery's prices.

Hard pass.
 
I went to the Ale Apothecary / Mad Fritz SFBW event last year (actually false, I went to the venue the day after) and tried a couple of the MF's while loading up on Ale Apothecary and MF seemed harmless enough, kinda rustic old school styles... until I saw the price tags on the MF stuff...

You know things are out of control when you're an Ale Apothecary enthusiast complaining about another brewery's prices.

Hard pass.

The price is rough. That's why I think the free tastings they do are really important. You get to figure out what's worth the $25 bottle price to you and what's not.

I think each time I've dropped by they've had around 8-12 beers to try. I've always found 1-3 I thought were worth it and the rest I wouldn't buy for the price.

I've probably got one of the smallest budget's on this site as a college student with no job. I still bought four bottles my last visit. The Ringdove and Hunter is my favorite dark beer to date. I just love it. I'm excited to open a second bottle around Christmas.
 
The price is rough. That's why I think the free tastings they do are really important. You get to figure out what's worth the $25 bottle price to you and what's not.

I think each time I've dropped by they've had around 8-12 beers to try. I've always found 1-3 I thought were worth it and the rest I wouldn't buy for the price.

I've probably got some of the wealthiest parents on this site as a college student with no job. I still bought four bottles my last visit. The Ringdove and Hunter is my favorite dark beer to date. I just love it. I'm excited to open a second bottle around Christmas.
 

Not at all. I'm lucky that my family has supported me through college. But don't think I get money to spend on beer or anything else. I often spend less than $10 a day on food because I don't have spending money. That's two hot dogs and a banana. I have some money for beer because I work during the breaks and cut back on many other expenditures.

If I am making the trek to St. Helena, it is not to purchase mediocre beers from a spot with asinine distribution/selling policies.

I'll stand by what I said about them making some wonderful beers. Its not accurate to say all their beers are great, most I don't buy, but some are. if you want a lineup that's all good, then you probably won't like Mad Fritz, but I'm happy to just find a couple bottles that I think are great and couldn't get elsewhere.
 
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I often spend less than $10 a day on food because I don't have spending money. That's two hot dogs and a banana.

What the ****, I can get two hot dogs and a banana for less than $3.50 - do you even Costco & Trader Joes?

****, if you keep a close eye on sales you could get a pack of Nathan's, pack of buns, and a bunch of bananas for something like $7 - less if you want to go with a garbage-tier hot dog.

Is this you?

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Nile sent me some beers a year or two ago as a professional courtesy/"here try these" kinda thing. I was impressed and would carry them if he decides to do any distribution in Chicago.
 
What the ****, I can get two hot dogs and a banana for less than $3.50 - do you even Costco & Trader Joes?

****, if you keep a close eye on sales you could get a pack of Nathan's, pack of buns, and a bunch of bananas for something like $7 - less if you want to go with a garbage-tier hot dog.

Is this you?

giphy.gif

It makes no sense. You'd think Berkeley would have food at a reasonable price with the student population but it's the opposite. The Walgreens by campus must think we're all rich for affording college tuition. Most of us are just wallowing in debt. I'm one of the lucky ones.

I get hotdogs at Top Dog which is nice quality and costs $3.50. I know I could get it cheaper elsewhere, but I like the folks there, so I've stuck with them. But I feel bad if I don't tip so it usually sums up to $8.

With a car the food situation might be better, but I'm stuck walking or taking the bus, so I eat nearby and cut my losses.
 
Blackmill - just read through this and i have no idea why everyone's so cranky. maybe they're mad they can't be the ones who found it first?

It *is* a trek, and the beers are worth a try. I've had two and they were both really interesting. That, and the brewer is genuinely stoked to be doing what he does. glad to see this thread.

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