Is Jim Koch mad?

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Hah, just came here to post that article. The opening paragraphs are just painful, this in particular:

Staring at the beer menu, Koch began to criticize the selection. More than half of it, he said, wasn’t worthy of being served—inadvertently insulting the establishment’s owner, who unbeknownst to Koch was sitting next to him. Then Koch interrogated the beer manager about the offerings. Unsatisfied with the answers, Koch complained about the beers so intensely that an employee at the bar teared up. Koch rose from his seat and walked into the keg room, where he started checking freshness dates on his competitors’ kegs.

Not sure what's worse: him throwing a hissy fit over the beer selection, or someone actually "tearing up" about it.

Also this had me partly laughing, partly shaking my head:

Today’s craft-beer industry is highly balkanized and new breweries are much smaller, eclectic, and artisanal, with brands such as Sexual Chocolate Imperial Stout, Duck-Duck-Gooze, and Blind Pig IPA. In addition to hops, today’s beer nerds crave pedigree and a good story. They want to know what farmer grew which type of hop on what farm, and whether the brewery can be trusted.

Incredible overuse of the word "hipster" as well throughout that article.
 
the guy did start off fighting the good fight. created a business that eventually challenged the big boys and opened the door for many, many (too many?) people to charge through.

he succeeded, writ large, in much the same way as a lot of entrepreneurs would like.

it's hilarious to me that people hate him. he's a pioneer. this is bashing the Ramones because they aren't punk enough for today's tastes.
 
the guy did start off fighting the good fight. created a business that eventually challenged the big boys and opened the door for many, many (too many?) people to charge through.

he succeeded, writ large, in much the same way as a lot of entrepreneurs would like.

it's hilarious to me that people hate him. he's a pioneer. this is bashing the Ramones because they aren't punk enough for today's tastes.

"Staring at the beer menu, Koch began to criticize the selection. More than half of it, he said, wasn’t worthy of being served—inadvertently insulting the establishment’s owner, who unbeknownst to Koch was sitting next to him. Then Koch interrogated the beer manager about the offerings. Unsatisfied with the answers, Koch complained about the beers so intensely that an employee at the bar teared up. Koch rose from his seat and walked into the keg room, where he started checking freshness dates on his competitors’ kegs."

Yeah, what a hero.
 
the guy did start off fighting the good fight. created a business that eventually challenged the big boys and opened the door for many, many (too many?) people to charge through.

he succeeded, writ large, in much the same way as a lot of entrepreneurs would like.

it's hilarious to me that people hate him. he's a pioneer. this is bashing the Ramones because they aren't punk enough for today's tastes.
I don't see many 'stomping' on Koch. Should we continue drinking his beer when there are so many better options just because he was there first?

Tastes have changed. He didn't keep up with the times. He's mad about it.
 
"Staring at the beer menu, Koch began to criticize the selection. More than half of it, he said, wasn’t worthy of being served—inadvertently insulting the establishment’s owner, who unbeknownst to Koch was sitting next to him. Then Koch interrogated the beer manager about the offerings. Unsatisfied with the answers, Koch complained about the beers so intensely that an employee at the bar teared up. Koch rose from his seat and walked into the keg room, where he started checking freshness dates on his competitors’ kegs."

Yeah, what a hero.

i, for one, am shocked that someone driven enough to build a billion dollar business would be a dick.

SHOCKED i said.
 
Hah, just came here to post that article. The opening paragraphs are just painful, this in particular:



Not sure what's worse: him throwing a hissy fit over the beer selection, or someone actually "tearing up" about it.

Also this had me partly laughing, partly shaking my head:



Incredible overuse of the word "hipster" as well throughout that article.
I know I care immensely about which farm my beer's hops came from. IMMENSELY.
 
I know I had to fight back tears when reading about how poor Jim Koch has to resort to making IPAs, Angry Orchard and Twisted Tea to help maintain his billionaire status.

Whatever. I didn't care for SABL 20 years ago either. And while a lot of the current craft beer culture irritates the **** out of me sometimes, for Koch to ***** about it shows a lack of understanding of the market and pretty much the antithesis of the image he originally created for himself. If it pains him so much, he should just sell his stake in BBC to one of the conglomerates and go brew rare limited release lager waelz of specious quality so neckbeards will get all excited.
 
I don't see many 'stomping' on Koch. Should we continue drinking his beer when there are so many better options just because he was there first?

Tastes have changed. He didn't keep up with the times. He's mad about it.

he should be mad about it. he should be mad at himself for not keeping up if he wants to stay relevant. he said it himself, if he weren't sole shareholder than he would probably have been fired a few times.

i enjoy the new beers, new flavors and new chick with bolt-ons as much as the next guy... but in a tortured kinda way. still with respect for the past and not the overt anger that, it seems, present company notwithstanding, a lot of people have for what was once great.

i'm thinking about it in terms of how Europeans seem to respect tradition. Orval has been around forever... Europeans aren't destroying it as **** beer that hasn't kept up with the times.
 
A good description of Jim Koch, no?

pretty much, yes

and what is happening/has happened to Sam Adama is happening to Stone now. and Goose Island. and it will happen to (insert new'ish popular brewery) in 10 years and it will happen to (insert nano-brewery of the moment that takes off) in 10 years, etc.

we love it and we cheer it on and we build it up... until we get tired of it.. then we relish in tearing it down, stomping it to bits and pissing on it.... until we yearn for how great things used to be and we bring it back.

wait for the boomerang, Jim! you're almost there!
 
Incredible overuse of the word "hipster" as well throughout that article.
The funniest part of that paragraph you quoted is that we choose our beers based on whether or not we can trust the brewery. There are so many dipshit brewers out there that perform PR seppuku nearly every week, and yet we still flock to their tasting rooms to scoop up the latest whale. We don't have a romantic relationship with these ****ers; it's more friends with benefits than anything.
 
the guy did start off fighting the good fight. created a business that eventually challenged the big boys and opened the door for many, many (too many?) people to charge through.

he succeeded, writ large, in much the same way as a lot of entrepreneurs would like.

it's hilarious to me that people hate him. he's a pioneer. this is bashing the Ramones because they aren't punk enough for today's tastes.

did you read at all? nobody bashed him... we're now bashing his crying, but that's it... I don't have to drink his beer or care for what he's doing to appreciate what he did in the past...
 
Seems pretty obvious that his beers range anywhere from mediocre to bad compared to the rest of his industry. When craft beer was a shiny new toy he was a notch above the fizzy piss water available. His personal taste has become antiquated and he's now the angry old man telling kids to get off his lawn. Guess he'll have to dry all those tears with stacks of $100 bills
 
pretty much, yes

and what is happening/has happened to Sam Adama is happening to Stone now. and Goose Island. and it will happen to (insert new'ish popular brewery) in 10 years and it will happen to (insert nano-brewery of the moment that takes off) in 10 years, etc.

we love it and we cheer it on and we build it up... until we get tired of it.. then we relish in tearing it down, stomping it to bits and pissing on it.... until we yearn for how great things used to be and we bring it back.

wait for the boomerang, Jim! you're almost there!
He got to the top through innovation. Many had not experienced beer like his prior. It is strange to see him now damning other breweries for being innovative.
 
Oh_he_mad.jpg




I still buy a 12 pack of Boston lager cans now and then. It's a basic, tasty lager that does the trick when your ****ing around in the yard, or camping, etc.
 
He got to the top through innovation. Many had not experienced beer like his prior. It is strange to see him now damning other breweries for being innovative.

Utopias is still a delectable treat and completely off the wall in terms of what beer can be. He's embraced that, but begrudgingly brewed a West Coast IPA for the first time this year? It makes no sense.
 
did you read at all? nobody bashed him... we're now bashing his crying, but that's it... I don't have to drink his beer or care for what he's doing to appreciate what he did in the past...

True.

I agree with Treebs, it has been/still is/will continue to be the "gateway" beer for many people to get away from the other stuff.

Got to meet him at Rare Beers, was a super nice guy but it is interesting that he was hanging with Sam Calagione. The line to get a beer from Sam and get your picture taken with him was huge. (Gene and Steve can attest) IMO the torch has kinda been passed from Jim to Sam as "torch bearer" of the "craft beer movement" And now I feel DFH is getting the same treatment, namely that most of us will choose something different/better because they both paved the way for beer to be better than it used to be.

It still all comes down to this: It's just ****ing beer and drink what you like.
 
the guy did start off fighting the good fight. created a business that eventually challenged the big boys and opened the door for many, many (too many?) people to charge through.

he succeeded, writ large, in much the same way as a lot of entrepreneurs would like.

it's hilarious to me that people hate him. He is was a pioneer. this is bashing the Ramones because they aren't punk enough for today's tastes.
Fixed that for you. Times are constantly changing. His brewery hasn't really branched out or experimented lately as far as I know. I don't even give SA a cursory glance since 2013 (roughly the last time I drank a Sam Adams beer)
 
Seems pretty obvious that his beers range anywhere from mediocre to bad compared to the rest of his industry.

I get your point, but far too often do we as the little online beer cult equate "the rest of the industry" with the beer we commonly pursue. Are they the same level of quality as many of our favorites? no. but for about $1/bottle, they beat the hell out of a lot of the random microbrew **** cluttering up the beer isle.

They certainly aren't the best, but they make a decent quality product with remarkable consistency, and i don't think that puts them at the bottom of the industry.


Also, the "fit" seems reproachable, but with the way the rest of the article is written I wouldn't be surprised if it's embellished a whole lot, but who knows.
 
did you read at all? nobody bashed him... we're now bashing his crying, but that's it... I don't have to drink his beer or care for what he's doing to appreciate what he did in the past...

yes, because the Sam Adams bashing is strictly limited not just to this forum but this thread and only the people who respond to this thread.

in the future i'll be careful to skim the forums to make sure i'm not expressing an already agreed upon opinion.
 
He got to the top through innovation. Many had not experienced beer like his prior. It is strange to see him now damning other breweries for being innovative.

it's the cycle of life, isn't it?

right off the top of my head i can only think of a couple legends/pioneers who turned on their roots/continued to innovate well above and beyond their roots.. Miles Davis (genius) comes to mind.

most just keep plugging away, doing what got them to the pinnacle because it's what they know. it's what they love. they aren't adapting to the times and many hate new music/art/food/etc.

i agree that he should continue to innovate and adapt rather than being mad about the changing environment.. but.. human nature, you know?
 
yes, because the Sam Adams bashing is strictly limited not just to this forum but this thread and only the people who respond to this thread.

in the future i'll be careful to skim the forums to make sure i'm not expressing an already agreed upon opinion.

okay, just so long as we agree that your rant about people crapping on Sam Adams had nothing to do with what the tread is about... cry away
 
I love the dichotomy that's always presented by people making the argument Koch and his supporters do in this article. Either you drink, admire, and enjoy their flagships and standbys, or you're a hipster who is constantly only chasing the newest thing, the hoppiest IPA, or the stout with the most adjuncts in it.

I'll fully admit to enjoying ticking new beers as much as I can, and to liking many of the styles that Koch apparently derides. But I also spend a ton of time drinking old stand-bys, contrary to what he might think. It's just for me those stand-bys happen to be things like Bells Two-Hearted and Kalamazoo Stout, Sierra Nevada Kellerweis, Lagunitas IPA, and Victory Prima Pils, not Sam Adams Boston Lager or anything else he makes. Ironically enough, I think Rebel IPA is perfectly fine for what it is and I've ordered it at a bar more than once.
 
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